Wsay is getting out of hand

[Kumog]

As of late, I've seen Rand been enforcing the rules on Wsay much more than normal, which I can fully agree with. I'm wanting the rules to be upheld, so that THG isn't full of sex-talk and other BS on Wsay, when it's a well known fact that we have twelve year olds playing it. When me and Kyou had to deal with a bunch of folks, no BH were active at the time. We pointed out the rules to them, explicitly "We want the game to be family-oriented". They would not listen.

Hence, I request for the rule to be expanded as to tell people to not do sex talk on Wsay. It's ridiculous how much they tried to weedle out of being in the wrong by saying "lol it doesn't say i cant talk about how we all <insert sexual epithet here>"

With this rule firmly listed, it would prevent folks from being able to argue about what is 'family oriented', and thus would help other players be better able to get the rules across to someone when a brotherhood member is not available.

[Rand]

People know what family oriented is. If they want to claim "It doesn't say I cant mention swa or bu so therefore it's fine " then they can claim my boot in their backside and a healthy vacation. People know better, and trying to hide behind the rules' strict listing doesn't change that. Excuses. They were not ignorant. If someone wishes to change the rules they can. I for one will simply stop being nice from this point on.

[mikehappy]

I'mjust getting tired of the general ignorance and idiocy over worldsay. People acting like pokemon, cats, idiots, fighting and just generally ignoring rules. Saying 'Please stop' isn't helping this at all. I don't want to ignore world chat as this is my way of knowing where all parties are. I've had to ignore people I really don't mind most of the time because of this stuff. It's getting pointless and retarded. Well, venting has made me feel a little better. Back to adding people to my ignore list.

[Krelian]

as retarded as it may be, i'll sugest it anyway... Even tough i think this has already been sugested...

Maybe a new tab where you can input party requests... you could ignore world, and then just check there
- Cath party, 2 spots at the top ( by player *************)
- DM party, 4 spots at the entrance (by player ******)
- Magora party, join now!! ( by ******)

yeah, yeah... there is a "duel request" thing at dmo and that is where i copied this idea from. Dont know if it could be used, but w/e.

[Jumin]

I like Krelian's suggestion a lot. It would help clean up the wsay a bit with the party request spam that occurs sometimes

[Kumog]

I also like Krelian's suggestion, but I have some additions to it.

Have it say how many folks are in the party, so that one doesn't go "Ooh, three spots!", get there with two friends, and discover only one spot was left.

Also, allow one to use the Inspect Party command on there, to see who all is in it. This would allow someone to be sure they aren't joining a party with someone that they don't get along with.

[Rand]

I Love this idea. Hmm........

[Krelian]

this night i was thinking about this, and came up with another idea, wich is more or less what kumog said...


just like the 'who' command, we could have a 'check parties' command, if that may be more simple than a new tab. It would basically be like the who command, a list of all players, but they would be shown in their groups.

like this (for those who dont get it)

Krelian (key name) lvl 99
Ramsus (same as above) lvl 99.5
Coco
wisdom
------------

Flyer ( ) lvl -100
Kain
Constantine
Jumin
U Dye
-------------


then, by checking this info you could pretty much use "tell" and ask the party leader where they are and ask if you could join, though by seeing their lvls you could have a guess already.

[Vahu]

I find these ideas to be extremely useful for reasons already mentioned.

[Constantine]

A second who verb that groups people by party it is then?

I approve.

[U. Dye]

I second the motion. This looks like a damn good idea. I would, however, like to add the idea of leaving locked parties and full parties off this list. If a party is full, obviously there's no room for more. If a party is locked, then it's probably safe to assume they don't WANT anymore.

[Rand]

Good notion, Dye. Kija, your take on this?

[Taterz]

oh hellllll no mike did not just diss on my mudkipz

[Mahn]

According to Kija from previous threads on a "syphisticated" who or "party" command, one is plan. I'm guessing it would go along with the "custom" interface 4.0 uses, since an interface is also planned. Which means, FFTHG would be upgraded to 4.0 then. Which, Kija plans that happens when V8 is released.

[Hiroshima]

this thread hasrecently been brought to my attention, sorry it's so late. Anyway, on the ORIGINAL topic of things. i disagree entirely on restricted Wsay more than it already is, there have been talks before on people being too inappropriate over Wsay and whiners have come and gone. The only thing that's been done is the swear filter and some understandale rules but one thing was made certain, this is an online game, things that 12 y.o's probably shouldn't hear will be said and that's how it goes. I do not understand why i am not allowed to talk about something potentially hilarious over Wsay because the possibility of a younger person being around to see it. I'd be willing to bet they've already Heard, uhm, everything there is to hear over the internet from other online games, and if they haven’t, they will. I completely and 100% disagree with enforcing talk to the point where I can’t say the word penis without being potentially booted, let alone the talk about a penis, or sex or anything in the very large range of topics. Would you really limit us so much? What’s left to talk about, half of media today is all about sex related things, so now what will we have, THG, other games? Politics? Oh noes, people might get into a heated discussion about Obama or Clinton and A) get booted B) get banned C) have some whiner come to the forums and post about how people are getting out of hand again and then, uh oh, one less topic we can talk about. This is a terrible idea, and kumog, if you can’t deal with the word penis, vagina, boobs, sex, etc. go live under a rock cause you’ll be hearing it for a very, very, very, very, very long time and if you can’t handle a day without recording EVERYTHING you see and running to rand, you need to grow the hell up.

[Kyou]

I'm sorry you feel that way Hiro. One of the reasons I like this game and have stayed as part of its community for so long is because of its regulations on its world channels. Its one of the defining features that keeps me, the dedicated player, free from constant: spam, derogatory language, offensive subjects, that I do see regularly from mainstream media, and if I have to sacrifice a few potentially humorous conversations, then I'm fine with that. However, I rarely find conversations like that humorous and that was the case of the incident that brought about the original topic, it wasn't "potentially humorous" it was pointless spam that not only offended me, but others on the server at the time. As there were repeated pleas for them to stop the conversation on the public channel.

[Takahashi]

Well, just because a player expects to be able to talk about certain content when it's in the news doesn't mean that those who would rather talk about other matters need to turn off worldsay. Some people don't come to an online game to be reminded of what the real world is like, they come to have a brief escape from that real world. They can request (preferably politely) that conversations about rampant crime, homophobia, terrorist activities and what some random attention-grubbing celebrity is up to nowadays be nipped in the bud. They shouldn't be forced to turn off worldsay for the sake of people who may well feel that it is their god given right to discuss such things as if worldsay is their personal soapbox.

Regardless of how much questionable content there is, and this isn't aimed at anyone in particular, there's no excuse for logic like "Well, that person is going to hear about things like this anyways, so let me talk about what I happen to have on my mind." No, that's not how it works. One of the key rules for the game is that you RESPECT OTHERS. If someone is uncomfortable with the current subject matter on worldsay, the correct reaction is not, "Well just turn off worldsay if you don't want to hear the adults talk." You attempt to respect their wishes, no matter how whiny or childish you may think those wishes are. Maybe you can change the subject or continue the discussion with interested parties via tells; whatever works.

There is of course a limit to such things; some people will act like they can dictate what can and can't be said on worldsay in an attempt to mold it to their liking, even if the rules do not prevent certain fields of discussion from being discussed. That sort of behavior is just as bad as people who get indignant when someone dares ask them to tone down their discussion of what nationality of women they'd most want to give a hot beef injection to. Worldsay is not a belonging that anyone gets to dictate the terms of use for, beyond what the rules state.

If and when someone like myself starts making bawdy jokes and using blue humor, I am required to take a step back if someone is uncomfortable with what I say. I don't get to pull rank/seniority and say "I can talk like that if I want because I'm in the BH and I've been around this game for years now!". If they object on grounds along the lines of 'I don't like this discussion because it bothers me' as opposed to 'this should be against the rules and banned from discussion because of my beliefs', all the better.

Ultimately, no one should act like they're entitled to say (or have others not say) whatever they want to have said. Sometimes what you have to say will honestly bother someone, and so you should find a way to accomodate that someone. Sometimes what you think shouldn't be said over worldsay is something that can be discussed. As such. sometimes you'll have to find a way to tune out content that bothers you without detracting from your ability to read whatever else shows up on worldsay.

[Rand]

Kumog is a prime example of the kind of player I like having around, Ryan, because he's willing to let me know when people are being disruptive and need to be dealt with. He has done so more than once and I have greatly appreciated his assistance. The only reason you are complaining now, after all this time, is because last time found YOU in the mix as well, which is entirely your fault. If you dont like that, dont give him reason to record you. Fair?

Thank you, Faru. You eloquently put exactly what i wished to convey on this matter. I'd have sooner if not for work. WorldSay has RULES. These rules are easily found on the main website and are linked in th egame as well. One of them clearly states that if you can't chat about it with your family without blushes and throat clearing, you shouldnt do it here either. Tell me Ryan. When's the last time you discussed with your Mother, the finer points of a vagina or penis? Feel free to answer that anytime.

Saying that "If you dont like it turn Worldsay off" is bullshit. I've tried my best for a year now to make this game, as Kyou exactly stated,a place where you can get away from all the normal crappy media and what everyone's doing to everyone else. This is Darlow, not CNN. If you disagree with this decision by myself and the Brotherhood as a whole, just keep i mind no one's forcing you to play. As you've said so before to people, Ryan.

Frankly, I'm ashamed you were even a part of the recent issues. You, who were a member of the Brotherhood before I was and probably longer, should CLEARLY know the rules, as well as what's tolerable and what isn't. Stating that you're Hiroshima doesnt give you free access to say whatever you want. And if 3, 4 other people are asking you, REPEATEDLY, to change the topic, respecting their wishes means I get to continue being the good guy. It also means you're following the rules. Otherwise, you're not only breaking the family-oriented thing, but disrespecting fellow players as well.

In short, I will continue governing the WorldSay channels just as I have been,exactly the same for a year now, and nothing like what's been said, either verbal or in web sites, is going to be here. If you don't like that, there's a pretty red X button inviting you.

Otherwise, welcome to Darlow.

[Hiroshima]

No, rand, i'm not suddenly involved in this because i was in a Wsay 'argument' and no rule prohibits talk of genitalia. i have not seen one. you cannot enforce a rule that does not exist, it doesn't work like that, in fact, there's a rule that even says rules will not be made up and enforced unless that rule is specifically listed under the rules. and yes, i just looked, it's not listed. So i can talk about women, sex, penis', vaginas, boobs, asses, etc, etc, ETC. and you can do NOTHING about it. and why is that?



In case you couldn't guess it. VVV

SPOILER: Click to show

- The FFTHG Staff will never make up rules, add new rules, or oppress on its players without making it known to the gaming public of FFTHG.

You say you're ashamed of ME? jesus Rand, how can you enforce something that isn't a rule and call it a-okay? how can you say that i should know the rules and not be breaking them, and then brake one yourself in the process? i haven't broken any rule, yes, i insulted Ceci, after she did to me, and now we talk outside of THG and MSN.


At no point have i made the excuse of self-entitlement or atleast meant to, if i have then i apologize for that. However Ingore-World WAS made for a reason and to do precisely that, ignore the world; the same reason i can just turn off my TV, change the channel on it, Turn off radio, hang up a phone, close a book, etc; it's to stop listening/hearing/reading things that may/do offend me.. Also, i believe the topic of the different races of women had nothing to do with sticking anything in them, it was about the attractiveness, if i'm wrong i'm sure Kumog has his log somewhere an will notify us of my incorrectness on this topic.
Rand you agreed with Faru and how he put it yet you're the one molding Wsay whe there's no rules against certain topics, i will not argue this point if the BH decide to make it a rule until then i will.


And as for Kumog, there's a major difference between saying there are some problems and then recording everything and whining to somebody, he's trying to be big and bad as a regular player, i can understand reporting incidents but when he clearly states he's running off to tell You (whom everyone fears, and not in a good way or a way you want my friend) he tells you whatever anyone says, what would be the point of having 5 admins when everyone is? it's like if i had someone following me whenever i wasn't with my parents and if i said a 'bad word' they'd record it and run and tell them so i can get a new ass-hole ripped into me. What would be the point of leaving my mother's presence?

Do you really not trust us, the players, that much? can we not be left alone for 5 MINUTES without you running in and jailing/booting/banning the fucking shit out of us? are we really that untrustworthy? this shows a lack of respect and trust to every single player out there and i don't like that, at all, i'd be surpised if anyone does.

I can't believe, for how long i've been a member of this community, that i'm so untrusted by the runners of this community. I can't say the word boobs without somebody going "sssshh! rand might be logged in" or, "okay we should stop talking. Kumog might be here, or wose Rand" the players of FF:THG now officially live in complete and utter FEAR of you rand, because they can't talk about ANYTHING, i hope you're happy now.

[heavy sarcasm]Except for maybe Kumog, the perfect saint of THG.[/ heavy sarcam]

[lordphoenix]

hiroshima said:

No, rand, i'm not suddenly involved in this because i was in a Wsay 'argument' and no rule prohibits talk of genitalia. i have not seen one. you cannot enforce a rule that does not exist, it doesn't work like that, in fact, there's a rule that even says rules will not be made up and enforced unless that rule is specifically listed under the rules. and yes, i just looked, it's not listed. So i can talk about women, sex, penis', vaginas, boobs, asses, etc, etc, ETC. and you can do NOTHING about it. and why is that?



In case you couldn't guess it. VVV

SPOILER: Click to show

- The FFTHG Staff will never make up rules, add new rules, or oppress on its players without making it known to the gaming public of FFTHG.

You say you're ashamed of ME? jesus Rand, how can you enforce something that isn't a rule and call it a-okay? how can you say that i should know the rules and not be breaking them, and then brake one yourself in the process? i haven't broken any rule, yes, i insulted Ceci, after she did to me, and now we talk outside of THG and MSN.


At no point have i made the excuse of self-entitlement or atleast meant to, if i have then i apologize for that. However Ingore-World WAS made for a reason and to do precisely that, ignore the world; the same reason i can just turn off my TV, change the channel on it, Turn off radio, hang up a phone, close a book, etc; it's to stop listening/hearing/reading things that may/do offend me.. Also, i believe the topic of the different races of women had nothing to do with sticking anything in them, it was about the attractiveness, if i'm wrong i'm sure Kumog has his log somewhere an will notify us of my incorrectness on this topic.
Rand you agreed with Faru and how he put it yet you're the one molding Wsay whe there's no rules against certain topics, i will not argue this point if the BH decide to make it a rule until then i will.


And as for Kumog, there's a major difference between saying there are some problems and then recording everything and whining to somebody, he's trying to be big and bad as a regular player, i can understand reporting incidents but when he clearly states he's running off to tell You (whom everyone fears, and not in a good way or a way you want my friend) he tells you whatever anyone says, what would be the point of having 5 admins when everyone is? it's like if i had someone following me whenever i wasn't with my parents and if i said a 'bad word' they'd record it and run and tell them so i can get a new ass-hole ripped into me. What would be the point of leaving my mother's presence?

Do you really not trust us, the players, that much? can we not be left alone for 5 MINUTES without you running in and jailing/booting/banning the fucking shit out of us? are we really that untrustworthy? this shows a lack of respect and trust to every single player out there and i don't like that, at all, i'd be surpised if anyone does.

I can't believe, for how long i've been a member of this community, that i'm so untrusted by the runners of this community. I can't say the word boobs without somebody going "sssshh! rand might be logged in" or, "okay we should stop talking. Kumog might be here, or wose Rand" the players of FF:THG now officially live in complete and utter FEAR of you rand, because they can't talk about ANYTHING, i hope you're happy now.

[heavy sarcasm]Except for maybe Kumog, the perfect saint of THG.[/ heavy sarcam]

Look, the reason I jumped on you like I did the other day wasn't so much that I was afraid of immaturity from you as immaturity from the other players. I really don't see the problem with using a word like asshole or saying someone has a stick up their ass on wsay, but even with xgod and his talk of powdering his nutsack and slapping someone, I could see right away the direction the conversation is heading in. You know as well as I do what happens when players see a few people getting sailor mouthed on wsay, the conversation begins spiraling downwards. Rand's whole point of being disappointed is that you know that as well as/better than anyone, being a former admin and having to deal with people who go wild with the profanity and outright sexual talk after seeing a few people saying slightly innocuous things like "lol boobies". Players have proven in the past that they cannot control themselves in regards to taking such discussions straight downhill, so we just don't engage in them when we can stand to, and we cut them off quickly. If that upsets you, blame your fellow man, because you know as well as anyone how the BYOND general populace is.

[Hiroshima]

I disagree.

To start, i know and understand any and all of your reasonings. Now.

I have had and seen conversations when it was thought (or true) that no admins were around, they did involved severe language and moderate insult, but it never escalated to a supreme point of anything, it always dies down and without the assistance of an admin, i've SEEN it happen. i KNOW our players are some of the BEST if not THE best in BYOND, we probably have the most mature player base around. That's why this bothers me so much, it wouldn't if i didn't feel that we can handle ourselves every now and again without playing in constant fear.


[EDIT] No XGod, i have not been trying to insult you in these replies.

[Rand]

The conversation you were a part of went FAR beyond what you're saying. I'm glad people fear me if they truly do. It means less people will act like asshats in the outset. I am never a bad person to talk to and I don't randomly punish. I'm telling YOU, Ryan, that what was going on was breaking the rule of respecting other players when they asked you repeatedly to stop, and that things went farther than they should have in the area of what's family-oriented and what's not. You still seem to think we're in the era of when Mettool was hosting and any-damn-thing goes. This is not the case. If you don't like it, fine, but I believe you ARE ranting at least partially due tot he fact you got called on it, because like I said, I've been doing it this way for a year now, and our playerbase still hits 50 online players, so I must be doing -something- right. If you don't like it, you don't have to be here.

And personally, I dont care what you have to say about Kumog or what he does, his saying he'll go to me is his way of telling you you're overstepping bounds and that if you dont stop (as LP has said, people dont know when to freaking stop and that's a prime example case) then I will MAKE it stop. And seeing as when I spoke to Takahashi about it, he didn't call me down for being a pretentious asshole or anything else, I'm pretty sure the staff don't mind me doing what I'm doing. If you object, you could always have talked to me personally on the matter, or to all of the Brotherhood via MSN. Instead of attention whoring on the Boards.

What you think is family oriented and what I do are obviously quite different. I don't instantly ban for the word "Boobs" or anything else. What went on last time was FAR beyond normalcy, and you simply cant see that only because you had your own wrist slapped and were part of it. Disagree all you like, but I'd rather you prove me wrong. And don't you dare accuse me of making up rules just as an excuse to play God. I told you what I was acting under, and so far the only person objecting is YOU. If I'm so terribly wrong in this and misguided, why has no one else stepped up to support you?

I'm waiting.

[InfiniteWisdom]

In regards to Hiro, i am sorry that you are upset and when i came back from being afk, you said you might leave. I just want to tell you that you shouldnt let things go too out of hand not because of the situation but because there are others that care about you, me being one of them. I hope you dont leave and since you were admin, i can see why you see some views as being correct and without fault. I have learned that you must agree with the admins even if they are wrong, much like a "customer is always right". I have had instances where i was misinterpreted and booted because i "enforced" some wsay comment, even though i did not, and was referred to the rules which didnt say anything about being able to talk freely about an aspect. Just as this situation happened, i let things slide because there is no reason to keep pushing things when people are hardheaded, wrong, or even right. Overall, i will be waiting for your return because i dont like rough goodbyes >_<....
~InfiniteWisdom

Lets all be friends!!!!!!!!

[Hiroshima]

since we're diving into the past, when Mett hosted. was it low server numbers? what? no? that's exactly what i thought. I'm sure that we're not hitting 50 members simply because of they way you 'govern' Wsay. And yes, i will accuse you of created rules to play god, because i think that's what you're doing and you haven't proved me wrong yet, just like apparently i'm only doing this because i was involved in something. same logic applies.

i don't care if no one supports me, i'd believe if i was anyone else i would have been banned posts ago, but because of my history with this game and being friends with you and a large amount of players/admins has kept you from banning me like i'm sure part of you wants to right now. i don't expect people to stand up with me, if i did i would have asked for support. No. this is just me, people may chime in as they want but i do not expect them to.

Yes fear is a good thing, Mahn mad that perfectly evident, people feared him and things were fine. but Rand, i dare say you've taken it further than Mahn ever did. people fear you more, and there is a large difference between a good fear of someone, and a bad one.


[Edit] since no one has posted again and i don't want to double post....Taka/Rand (not sure who said it and there's a LOT of text =x i apologize to whichever of you didn't say this) i notice a flaw and i thank Age of Wisdom for pointing it out over Wsay. if i should stop talking about something if someone says please stop, then arguably, if i want to control Wsay, all it takes is for me to say please stop. and they all have to listen, no? doesn't this contradict itself? to not control Wsay yet to have the power to stop all conversations because you SAY it offends you?

[Sur Realis]

hiroshima said:

No, rand, i'm not suddenly involved in this because i was in a Wsay 'argument' and no rule prohibits talk of genitalia. i have not seen one. you cannot enforce a rule that does not exist, it doesn't work like that, in fact, there's a rule that even says rules will not be made up and enforced unless that rule is specifically listed under the rules. and yes, i just looked, it's not listed. So i can talk about women, sex, penis', vaginas, boobs, asses, etc, etc, ETC. and you can do NOTHING about it. and why is that?



In case you couldn't guess it. VVV

SPOILER: Click to show

- The FFTHG Staff will never make up rules, add new rules, or oppress on its players without making it known to the gaming public of FFTHG.

You say you're ashamed of ME? jesus Rand, how can you enforce something that isn't a rule and call it a-okay? how can you say that i should know the rules and not be breaking them, and then brake one yourself in the process? i haven't broken any rule, yes, i insulted Ceci, after she did to me, and now we talk outside of THG and MSN.


At no point have i made the excuse of self-entitlement or atleast meant to, if i have then i apologize for that. However Ingore-World WAS made for a reason and to do precisely that, ignore the world; the same reason i can just turn off my TV, change the channel on it, Turn off radio, hang up a phone, close a book, etc; it's to stop listening/hearing/reading things that may/do offend me.. Also, i believe the topic of the different races of women had nothing to do with sticking anything in them, it was about the attractiveness, if i'm wrong i'm sure Kumog has his log somewhere an will notify us of my incorrectness on this topic.
Rand you agreed with Faru and how he put it yet you're the one molding Wsay whe there's no rules against certain topics, i will not argue this point if the BH decide to make it a rule until then i will.


And as for Kumog, there's a major difference between saying there are some problems and then recording everything and whining to somebody, he's trying to be big and bad as a regular player, i can understand reporting incidents but when he clearly states he's running off to tell You (whom everyone fears, and not in a good way or a way you want my friend) he tells you whatever anyone says, what would be the point of having 5 admins when everyone is? it's like if i had someone following me whenever i wasn't with my parents and if i said a 'bad word' they'd record it and run and tell them so i can get a new ass-hole ripped into me. What would be the point of leaving my mother's presence?

Do you really not trust us, the players, that much? can we not be left alone for 5 MINUTES without you running in and jailing/booting/banning the fucking shit out of us? are we really that untrustworthy? this shows a lack of respect and trust to every single player out there and i don't like that, at all, i'd be surpised if anyone does.

I can't believe, for how long i've been a member of this community, that i'm so untrusted by the runners of this community. I can't say the word boobs without somebody going "sssshh! rand might be logged in" or, "okay we should stop talking. Kumog might be here, or wose Rand" the players of FF:THG now officially live in complete and utter FEAR of you rand, because they can't talk about ANYTHING, i hope you're happy now.

[heavy sarcasm]Except for maybe Kumog, the perfect saint of THG.[/ heavy sarcam]

I don't know, I'm not that afraid of Rand. To be honest, I should probably be banned from the community with how I conduct myself, always throwing myself into dead-end arguements that only end in me being punished. I wasn't there for the entire arguement that you've gone and raised hell about, but from what I saw you pissed off Ceci and refused to apologize and just end it. I don't know, if you get so damned pissed off of one time where life didn't agree with you, you DESERVE to quit HG. I've been Jailed 3 times, Booted 7 times, and came close to a ban of a day, and yet here I am, still a part of the community, even probably slightly respected by most everyone even though I'm an epic asswipe. I just admit to myself that I went overboard in some way, even if I think I didn't or didn't know how, and just tried to act better.

Are you exempt from having to admit you were wrong because you were a former Brotherhood member? Just because you once had the powers that are pissing you off so much now anyone contradicting you is wrong? HELL NO! You say that everyone fears Rand, and yet I can be viewed as proof of otherwise. I've often had the guts to push his buttons just because. How is that fear? I respect him enough to abide by his wants and follow any orders he gives out, if he ever does give any. I don't do it because I fear him, I do it because I view him as better than me, because I -know- he is wiser than me.

As LP states, you were jumped on because of immaturity of other players. You must forget that the hellish majority of BYOND is under 16, probably even younger. BYOND is a small-scale program to help people interested in aspects of gaming test things out, and the majority of that are kids that are still fairly immature. If you sleep with the dogs, you will wake up with fleas, y'know. If you insult someone, they'll likely insult you back, and I am a prime example of that. You, being viewed as more mature by most everyone, and more respected, must end arguements, rather than fueling them. God knows I can't. And furthermore, if you quit after one mistake or whatever you want to call this, you deserve to quit. 'Whether you can or can't, you are wrong.'

And on top of all of this, it seems you started this entire thing.

Edit - And I agree with you about Ignore World, actually. If one person doesn't like the conversation, they can just ignore it. The difference is if MULTIPLE PEOPLE dislike the conversation.

[Rand]

Funny. Because when I log in, I get barraged with the same amount and kind of replies as I did a year ago. Oh, and, for your other points. Please refer to Takahashi's post. Which directly calls you out on teh whole worldsay ignore thing. Which is from another member of the Brotherhood, just like you wanted to see.

I haven't banned you because you've not done anything bannable. Us being friends or people not wanting you gone does not strike my conscience one bit. If Dagolar himself came on and acted like an asshat and spammed porn like half the jackasses I've banned, I'd deal with it exactly the same way. No one gets special treatment from me. If you want to downright accuse me of that, go ahead, and I'll take that as you wanting me to actually, in fact, ban you. I'd rather not, but if you force my hand with your stubborn-headed biased opinions, go ahead. Fact of the matter is, everything you've claimed I've either disproved or Takahashi has.

And the fact that I still have my robes and powers is living proof that I don't play God with what I have available. If everyone else thought so, I would be gone, and YOU of all people know that. No one else has complained about THAT either. Anything else?

Oh, and the fact that people thank on me WorldSayand Tells,and Kyou's post, probably supports the fact that my governing Wsay isn't exactly causing many sore teeth. Logs and this thread have proof on my side. I'm still waiting for yours. I'll reply to this again later when I get home. I've family to visit.

[Hiroshima]

Sur, me and Ceci have made up, i even said that, learn to read. and no, i would not be leaving based off of this one thing, it's multiple things that i have seen and witnessed or experienced over time. have i commited a wrong? only in insulting ceci back and getting into a further argument with her, yea i was wrong to do that, i also said that over Wsay, if you were even there and bothered to have payed attention you'd have known that. Another point, The powers are not what are bothering me, it's how they are being implemented and used by the people who hold those powers. again, learn to read and try again. Finally, yes, i have started all of this, and for that you are correct, but look, i've sparked a debate on the forums (something that doesn't happen all that often), i've done it before (look at the New Enlightenment Thread) and yet, here i am, doing it again, speaking my voice and opinion as i'm entitled to just as your entitled to your opinion. i will fight here on the forums, for everyone to see and comment. This section is made for complaints and it's exactly what is happening. a complaint.


Also, to clear things up. i never said i was leaving for good, so don't make comments on it and what that makes me, i said there's a chance and i also never stated why. for you to make assumptions is not so smart. were you even online when i made the Wsay comment?

[Edit] correction, i wanted other BH to agree on a rule against exactly whats allowed in Wsay. the entire reason why i'm bothering with this mess.


{edit (again so i don't double post)} Rand, do you not see where this is going? i'm giving you everything you need to create and enforce a rule that does not exist. look, you've gotten player support, i'm sure you have some/if not all BH support. bring it up. vote on it. done. Why wait =/


Anyone ever heard of the term. Devil's Advocate?

[Sur Realis]

You must have been so pissed off you didn't see:

<S-Key-Mo Realis (Wsay)>: DON'T
<S-Key-Mo Realis (Wsay)>: LEAVE

I saw your message. And I read it. And I reread it again. Something about your last forum post, and that you may never come back to the game again.

And, okay, I may not know much of why you are getting on Rand's case. In fact, basically all I know is what's in this thread, in which you've said more shit [analogy deleted.]

And why are you even bothering talking to me? I'm just one of those immature kids under 16 that stumbled upon BYOND one day. Just clarify why the hell you are still arguing, or just shut up entirely.

Edit - However, from your latest edit, I've come to believe you are jealous of Rand, in a way.

[Kija]

- Respect other players.
- Do not post links to porn or any other kind of adult websites. If the link is not something you'd be allowed to look at while at work or school, then don't post it.

Yes, the second rule mostly mentions links, but posting pornography like text would be pretty much the same thing. Sometimes it can only go so far before it gets out of hand.

If someone is uncomfortable about a topic or where the conversation is going, it would be very respectful to listen to them and do so. I understand that sometimes this is not always the case. If a group of people are talking about their favourite kind of cookies and someone starts complaining about how they do not want to hear you talk about some stupid cookie, then they can just ignore the world or try to change the subject. But if someone starts talking about something could be considered inappropriate or uncomfortable to someone, then it is not that simple. For instance, during Valentine's Day, a group of people were joking around with the whole "have my babies" thing. Someone felt a little uncomfortable and asked for the subject to change. Everyone there changed the subject immediately and still had fun. I can understand your worry that world say is being over controlled or that people could just use the uncomfortable excuse for anything. But if someone is seriously saying they are uncomfortable talking about favourite cookies, then either they need to be talking to someone about this problem, or they are full of shit.

The reason there were more players when Mettool was the host was because the game was not as old back then. All games eventually get less players, especially when they are not updated with a lot of new content for a long period of time. I highly doubt that if threw out all of the rules that the player numbers would start to rise significantly. And even if they did, I would not want to be in that game. I would rather be in a game with a smaller amount of people where I am not surrounded by fifty people all cybering on world say. Rules and the control of those rules are very important in creating a stable game. There has to be rules. There has to be order. But even with these rules, I think there is still a lot of freedom. The rules are not meant to try to control your every action and make you feel like we are just waiting to ban you. It is meant to try to make the game feel more friendly for everyone, so they do not feel like they to keep world on ignore or log out just because someone wants to talk about their nutsack or spam ascii porn. How many BYOND games do you know that let people have this sort of big debate and not just say "Screw it, you are banned. My rules loser!". That is quite some freedom. I have had plenty of debates with people, even in game, over certain actions or rules. And every time, I just talked with them. I did not ban them or boot them. Because that is the freedom we all have.

How often do you really see a conversation on world say get so out hand that it is stopped. How often do you see someone ask to change the subject on world say because it makes them feel uncomfortable? I would say, not very often. I have had plenty of conversations and fun things without going into highly inappropriate areas, and so have so many other people. This does not mean that you cannot talk about anything a bit inappropriate period. But there has to be a limit. There is a difference between joking around and saying "lol, I like boobies >.<" and "<insert conversation about favourite drugs and the use the of them> (Because yes, drugs are illegal, and they are not appropriate to talk about like that, ever, unless in a joking fashion, and even then, it is best to be careful how you say it)"

I hope that you do understand why the rules are the way they are. But if not, then I hope you at least understand that it is not meant as a power hungry ploy for more power and a chance to abuse them. Not that I am saying you do right now. But we all know how that ended with Mettool and his whole facism and power speech.

[icestol2m]

Im going to backtrack for a second here to a previous reply and i dont think your bashing me hiro besides i love publicity....

I dont think rand is acting as god or abusing his powers and i agree he is doing it for the best prime example on how rand feels for the community

[glow=red,2,300]---Announcement - Have fun, everyone. I'll be home in a few hours. Would you like me to reboot before I go? - Natewizard - Announcement---[/glow]

does not prove much on the topic but it shows his direction in what he is trying to do.

Further more i do agree with Hiro becuase tons of people yet to this day to continue spamming with insults and sexual perversions so why not make it a full fledged rule and ask for it to be takin' to tell if the person doesn't like it then bang ignore. now if you'll excuse me my Pizza PoPs are almost done