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Post by Bolt on Jun 16, 2008 15:34:29 GMT -6
Hell when I first made DD I was in IC. This was when you couldn't go back and powerlvl people as well. It was pretty easy to get him from lvl 1-5 solo. Sleep a few that can kill ya and use a friggen pitchfork!. A bluemage is just a theif with less hits, magic, and weapon availibilty.
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Post by Jumin on Jun 16, 2008 18:33:49 GMT -6
A bluemage is just a theif with less hits, magic, and weapon availibilty. I am without words.
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Post by Takahashi on Jun 16, 2008 18:35:01 GMT -6
What can also help is willing to settle for less than ideal armor at the start. This is especially true for the pure mages (Blue, White and Black), since I still see (and hear about) players who wait until they have enough gold to buy the fur robe, which leaves them with naked defense. Buying the hemp robe and the bronze tiara gives almost as much defense as the fur robe, weighs just as much combined and it costs less overall. Starting out with 17 defense instead of 6 goes a long way towards making ogres and the like less threatening, and you still have some gold left over that can be put into healing potions if necessary. If you save your gold from that point and don't buy a weapon, that means you have more gold stored up for better mage armor once you get into that 8 to 12 level range.
Melees and RMs can do much the same; Standard Leather gives 11 defense and leaves you with enough gold to buy a starting weapon of any type aside from a polearm. Through a combination of better vitality growth and/or better HP growth compared to the Three Mages, once you hit that 8 to 12 range you should also be in good shape with proper gold spending. Remembering that early on, staying alive long enough to hit things is more important than having the biggest and best Dainan weapon ASAP couldn't hurt either.
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Post by tinari on Jun 20, 2008 5:55:23 GMT -6
I made a fighter and ranger. I bought a medium sword, light leather and leather cap for the ranger, same but a mace for the fighter.
Very first battle, both characters died. And not an "almost" battle either. Three ogres and three imps for two level 1 characters? It was awful... It took another try with a thief who could actually manage to make hits and kills and the fighter and ranger just acting as extra HP and targets before we could level up reasonably. Of course, hitting level 2 changed the tides so well it was almost funny.
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Post by Takahashi on Jun 20, 2008 15:01:36 GMT -6
Well, light leather and a cap only adds, what, 7 defense? The difference between +11 defense and +7 at level 1 can be a big one. For a starting Fighter/Ranger, 18/17 starting defense compared to 14/13 cuts Giant Rat and Imp damage down to 1 outside of crits and disease, and it makes Ogres manageable (again outside of a crit or crit+slam hit) with a range of 1-5 damage on the Ranger and 1-4 on the Fighter.
Again, going with defense when first starting out over offense can easily mean the difference between having to look for outside help and being able to hold your own (albeit with some difficulty depending on luck).
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 20, 2008 17:11:30 GMT -6
Well, light leather and a cap only adds, what, 7 defense? The difference between +11 defense and +7 at level 1 can be a big one. For a starting Fighter/Ranger, 18/17 starting defense compared to 14/13 cuts Giant Rat and Imp damage down to 1 outside of crits and disease, and it makes Ogres manageable (again outside of a crit or crit+slam hit) with a range of 1-5 damage on the Ranger and 1-4 on the Fighter. Again, going with defense when first starting out over offense can easily mean the difference between having to look for outside help and being able to hold your own (albeit with some difficulty depending on luck). It saddens me that you'd expect someone that doesn't read enough to know how to access the shop to be able to buy armor to be more defense conscious. Especially considering that games now always hand people the first 20 levels on a silver platter.
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Post by Takahashi on Jun 20, 2008 17:21:31 GMT -6
Yes, well. I like to think that if it's noted enough times, then it'll start a trend where new players don't immediately get googly eyes once they realize they can buy some of the biggest weapons in Dainan with their starting cash... then wonder why they're getting turned into ground beef and missing 80% of the time. I'd hate to think that I'm part of a dying breed.
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Post by lordphoenix on Jun 20, 2008 17:28:46 GMT -6
I was going to start a new topic for the following but this one seemed better suited. Give each weapon class distinct type advantages and disadvantages, similar to the newer installments of the castlevania series. This alone would give players a big incentive to use something other than the weapon with the biggest attack power or most hits, or to carry multiple weapon types. Maybe even make it so certain skills could only be used with certain weapon classes (which is another thing I've been pushing for). Here's my personally suggested rundown:
Swords- Suited for slashing type attacks, as well as certain thrusting attacks. Exceptionally effective against soft skinned foes such as great worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Exceptionally weak against scaled or other hard skinned foes such as dragons, golems, and reptiles.
Daggers- Suited for vicious ripping and mutilation of a foe. Exceptionally effective against humanoid foes such as ogres, certain undeads, trolls, and giants. Exceptionally weak against spirits and other incorporeal foes.
Axes- Suited for chopping and bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against large beasts, armored foes, and material enemies, such as tigers, guards, golems, and corrupted men (dark knights, golden strikers). Exceptionally weak against small quick beasts and flying enemies, such as rats, gargoyles, eyes, cougars, and wolves.
Staves- Suited to a limited range of bashing, thrusting, and striking type attacks. Not particularly effective or ineffective to any given range of foes.
Blunts- Suited for bashing and crushing attacks. Exceptionally effective against brittle foes and plated insects, such as skeletons, snowmen, scorpions, and centipedes. Exceptionally weak against amorphous, incorporeal, and metal foes, such as guards, iron golemns, ghosts, elementals, and spirits.
Spears- Suited for piercing, thrusting, and a limited range of bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against hard skinned, scaled, and flying foes, such as dragons, reptiles, dinosaurs, gargoyles, and eyes. Exceptionally weak against soft bodied foes such as worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Very much converse to swords.
Polearms- Suited for a wide range of attack options, including slicing, chopping, thrusting, and bashing. It will not be as effective a choice for these options as other weapon types. Much like staves in terms of specific foes, though it will be slightly more effective against soft skinned, scaled, and beast type foes, and slightly less effective against material, plated, armored, and incorporeal enemies.
Also, another idea I've been considering is to give a few of the weapon types differing chances of after effects for an attack.
Daggers- 10% chance of bleeding damage, which is a non-removable status causing damage over time that varies in intensity and duration depending on the dagger used and the user's strength and dexterity scores. This damage will only apply to humanoids, beasts, and other foes that depend on blood as a source of vitality.
Blunts- 5% chance of paralysis after a successful attack, duration varies depending on the blunt used and the user's strength. 5% chance of causing confusion, duration varies on the same factors.
Spears- 20% chance of ignoring target's defense scores during an attack. 5% chance of causing goring damage varying in intensity depending on spear type and user strength.
I seek and appreciate direct feedback to this post, inside this thread, and not on messenger programs or in the game.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 20, 2008 17:32:43 GMT -6
I was going to start a new topic for the following but this one seemed better suited. Give each weapon class distinct type advantages and disadvantages, similar to the newer installments of the castlevania series. This alone would give players a big incentive to use something other than the weapon with the biggest attack power or most hits, or to carry multiple weapon types. Maybe even make it so certain skills could only be used with certain weapon classes (which is another thing I've been pushing for). Here's my personally suggested rundown: Swords- Suited for slashing type attacks, as well as certain thrusting attacks. Exceptionally effective against soft skinned foes such as great worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Exceptionally weak against scaled or other hard skinned foes such as dragons, golems, and reptiles. Daggers- Suited for vicious ripping and mutilation of a foe. Exceptionally effective against humanoid foes such as ogres, certain undeads, trolls, and giants. Exceptionally weak against spirits and other incorporeal foes. Axes- Suited for chopping and bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against large beasts, armored foes, and material enemies, such as tigers, guards, golems, and corrupted men (dark knights, golden strikers). Exceptionally weak against small quick beasts and flying enemies, such as rats, gargoyles, eyes, cougars, and wolves. Staves- Suited to a limited range of bashing, thrusting, and striking type attacks. Not particularly effective or ineffective to any given range of foes. Blunts- Suited for bashing and crushing attacks. Exceptionally effective against brittle foes and plated insects, such as skeletons, snowmen, scorpions, and centipedes. Exceptionally weak against amorphous, incorporeal, and metal foes, such as guards, iron golemns, ghosts, elementals, and spirits. Spears- Suited for piercing, thrusting, and a limited range of bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against hard skinned, scaled, and flying foes, such as dragons, reptiles, dinosaurs, gargoyles, and eyes. Exceptionally weak against soft bodied foes such as worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Very much converse to swords. Polearms- Suited for a wide range of attack options, including slicing, chopping, thrusting, and bashing. It will not be as effective a choice for these options as other weapon types. Much like staves in terms of specific foes, though it will be slightly more effective against soft skinned, scaled, and beast type foes, and slightly less effective against material, plated, armored, and incorporeal enemies. Also, another idea I've been considering is to give a few of the weapon types differing chances of after effects for an attack. Daggers- 10% chance of bleeding damage, which is a non-removable status causing damage over time that varies in intensity and duration depending on the dagger used and the user's strength and dexterity scores. This damage will only apply to humanoids, beasts, and other foes that depend on blood as a source of vitality. Blunts- 5% chance of paralysis after a successful attack, duration varies depending on the blunt used and the user's strength. 5% chance of causing confusion, duration varies on the same factors. Spears- 20% chance of ignoring target's defense scores during an attack. 5% chance of causing goring damage varying in intensity depending on spear type and user strength. I seek and appreciate direct feedback to this post, inside this thread, and not on messenger programs or in the game. If this gets put in, I DEMAND Hassites be color-blind. Okay? Make it so. Edit It all looks good and sensible. More feedback to come when I sleep.
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Post by Button on Jun 20, 2008 17:48:39 GMT -6
I was going to start a new topic for the following but this one seemed better suited. Give each weapon class distinct type advantages and disadvantages, similar to the newer installments of the castlevania series. This alone would give players a big incentive to use something other than the weapon with the biggest attack power or most hits, or to carry multiple weapon types. Maybe even make it so certain skills could only be used with certain weapon classes (which is another thing I've been pushing for). Here's my personally suggested rundown: Swords- Suited for slashing type attacks, as well as certain thrusting attacks. Exceptionally effective against soft skinned foes such as great worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Exceptionally weak against scaled or other hard skinned foes such as dragons, golems, and reptiles. Daggers- Suited for vicious ripping and mutilation of a foe. Exceptionally effective against humanoid foes such as ogres, certain undeads, trolls, and giants. Exceptionally weak against spirits and other incorporeal foes. Axes- Suited for chopping and bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against large beasts, armored foes, and material enemies, such as tigers, guards, golems, and corrupted men (dark knights, golden strikers). Exceptionally weak against small quick beasts and flying enemies, such as rats, gargoyles, eyes, cougars, and wolves. Staves- Suited to a limited range of bashing, thrusting, and striking type attacks. Not particularly effective or ineffective to any given range of foes. Blunts- Suited for bashing and crushing attacks. Exceptionally effective against brittle foes and plated insects, such as skeletons, snowmen, scorpions, and centipedes. Exceptionally weak against amorphous, incorporeal, and metal foes, such as guards, iron golemns, ghosts, elementals, and spirits. Spears- Suited for piercing, thrusting, and a limited range of bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against hard skinned, scaled, and flying foes, such as dragons, reptiles, dinosaurs, gargoyles, and eyes. Exceptionally weak against soft bodied foes such as worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Very much converse to swords. Polearms- Suited for a wide range of attack options, including slicing, chopping, thrusting, and bashing. It will not be as effective a choice for these options as other weapon types. Much like staves in terms of specific foes, though it will be slightly more effective against soft skinned, scaled, and beast type foes, and slightly less effective against material, plated, armored, and incorporeal enemies. Also, another idea I've been considering is to give a few of the weapon types differing chances of after effects for an attack. Daggers- 10% chance of bleeding damage, which is a non-removable status causing damage over time that varies in intensity and duration depending on the dagger used and the user's strength and dexterity scores. This damage will only apply to humanoids, beasts, and other foes that depend on blood as a source of vitality. Blunts- 5% chance of paralysis after a successful attack, duration varies depending on the blunt used and the user's strength. 5% chance of causing confusion, duration varies on the same factors. Spears- 20% chance of ignoring target's defense scores during an attack. 5% chance of causing goring damage varying in intensity depending on spear type and user strength. I seek and appreciate direct feedback to this post, inside this thread, and not on messenger programs or in the game. I love the ideas, I already carry multiple weapons just because I get tired of seeing the icon of one, but it would be great to actually have a reason to switch my weapon.
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Post by Kyou on Jun 20, 2008 20:25:19 GMT -6
I was going to start a new topic for the following but this one seemed better suited. Give each weapon class distinct type advantages and disadvantages, similar to the newer installments of the castlevania series. This alone would give players a big incentive to use something other than the weapon with the biggest attack power or most hits, or to carry multiple weapon types. Maybe even make it so certain skills could only be used with certain weapon classes (which is another thing I've been pushing for). Here's my personally suggested rundown: Swords- Suited for slashing type attacks, as well as certain thrusting attacks. Exceptionally effective against soft skinned foes such as great worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Exceptionally weak against scaled or other hard skinned foes such as dragons, golems, and reptiles. Daggers- Suited for vicious ripping and mutilation of a foe. Exceptionally effective against humanoid foes such as ogres, certain undeads, trolls, and giants. Exceptionally weak against spirits and other incorporeal foes. Axes- Suited for chopping and bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against large beasts, armored foes, and material enemies, such as tigers, guards, golems, and corrupted men (dark knights, golden strikers). Exceptionally weak against small quick beasts and flying enemies, such as rats, gargoyles, eyes, cougars, and wolves. Staves- Suited to a limited range of bashing, thrusting, and striking type attacks. Not particularly effective or ineffective to any given range of foes. Blunts- Suited for bashing and crushing attacks. Exceptionally effective against brittle foes and plated insects, such as skeletons, snowmen, scorpions, and centipedes. Exceptionally weak against amorphous, incorporeal, and metal foes, such as guards, iron golemns, ghosts, elementals, and spirits. Spears- Suited for piercing, thrusting, and a limited range of bashing attacks. Exceptionally effective against hard skinned, scaled, and flying foes, such as dragons, reptiles, dinosaurs, gargoyles, and eyes. Exceptionally weak against soft bodied foes such as worms, snakes, and crawler type enemies. Very much converse to swords. Polearms- Suited for a wide range of attack options, including slicing, chopping, thrusting, and bashing. It will not be as effective a choice for these options as other weapon types. Much like staves in terms of specific foes, though it will be slightly more effective against soft skinned, scaled, and beast type foes, and slightly less effective against material, plated, armored, and incorporeal enemies. Also, another idea I've been considering is to give a few of the weapon types differing chances of after effects for an attack. Daggers- 10% chance of bleeding damage, which is a non-removable status causing damage over time that varies in intensity and duration depending on the dagger used and the user's strength and dexterity scores. This damage will only apply to humanoids, beasts, and other foes that depend on blood as a source of vitality. Blunts- 5% chance of paralysis after a successful attack, duration varies depending on the blunt used and the user's strength. 5% chance of causing confusion, duration varies on the same factors. Spears- 20% chance of ignoring target's defense scores during an attack. 5% chance of causing goring damage varying in intensity depending on spear type and user strength. I seek and appreciate direct feedback to this post, inside this thread, and not on messenger programs or in the game. I wonder if they'll ever get tired of us clamoring for these weapon effects LP. As you already know, I like the idea. Maybe instead of differing damage ratings you can just have it effect the chance of criticals and weak hits. Like Daggers will do mortal wounds and criticals more often on the Trolls, Ogres, and I'm guessing zombies (not skeletons), but more likely to do weak hits on the ghosts and elementals. My only "bitch" point would be spears having a chance to completely ignore defense. That can be pretty effective later in the game, I'd rather a "stuck" status where the targeted enemy would have his evasion speed set to 0, serving 2 purposes, making him go last that round (thus making quick players more "handy" with a spear) and making them extremely easy to hit, so you can get a "team up" situation going. another minor bitch, if the daggers are good against the "fleshy" undead, then the axe and blunts should be effective against skeletons and such, I mean, if you knock their bones everywhere wtf they gonna do to youz? Also, I think the monsters attack should vary like this also, for example, tigers are slashing, ogres are smashing etc etc. This can make some monsters more of a threat too because they can do more then 1 type of attack. Take the dinos of SS for instance, they can bite you (dagger effects), Slash with claws (sword effect), Whack with tail (stave effect for small dinos, blunt effect for big ones), Impale you (spikes from armored ones, jabbing with feet claws), Crush you (getting stamped on by Rex). Notice I picked dinosaurs for their versatility. And then you can choose your armor to combat the specific foes for the area you'll be fighting in.
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Post by Takahashi on Jun 21, 2008 18:32:49 GMT -6
Something that has been tossed around is breaking weapons down into multiple damage types, sort of like how there are eight or so when it comes to magic. This way, there's more to account for when it comes to picking a weapon. Two different weapons may end up with identical damage potential, but be useful in different areas based off of their type. This would go alongside damage value retooling; currently axes and swords are in a class of their own, as are (unfortunately) spears and staves.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 21, 2008 21:07:24 GMT -6
I've probably mentioned this before, but it would be -really- REALLY nice to have a 'Repeat Last Action' command, right above Run. After I Hide, if I'm Backstabbing, I'm pretty much Backstabbing the same monster 6 times in a row. If I'm Bloody Murdering, why would I want to jump around on enemies if it Misses?
This would really lighten it up for people that need to do pretty much the same thing but have to go through multiple boxes. Take Dragoons. If they want to jump, they have to do this:
Sky Fighting -> Jump -> Attack -> Enemy
Casting an area elemental?
Magic -> Fire -> Area -> Enemy
That does get to be a bit many boxes after a while. Instead, a repeat last action command could cut it down to:
Repeat Fire 1 Area -> Enemy
Or even
Repeat Fire 1 Area 3
It cuts down on time choosing the action and it will lower the overall input.Proc (?) overflow that causes our much beloved crashes.
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Post by Firemaster on Jun 22, 2008 19:58:05 GMT -6
Boosts...
I dont get it..
In Mona...
Boost 3 can get overrunned by Weak 1? Wtf. And when your weak1'ed already you have to waste another Boost 3 to get the actual boost in?
I think its neccessary that if you have a Weak 1 on you and you boost 3 you should get a Boost 2 stats.. Since 3 minus 1 equals 2 right?
I think this is neccessary cuz I HATE IT when a Friggin Mummy Weaks a Knight before you can Boost 3 and it doesnt do anything. And then you just gotta waste another 38 MP just to friggin get the job done right.
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Post by Kyou on Jun 22, 2008 20:22:53 GMT -6
The best way to fix that is to give the mummies weak 3.
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Post by Ambush Magnet on Jun 23, 2008 0:58:40 GMT -6
Or failing that, have Weak 1 reduce the effect of Boost 3 to be that of Boost 1.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 23, 2008 5:32:05 GMT -6
Boosts... I dont get it.. In Mona... Boost 3 can get overrunned by Weak 1? Wtf. And when your weak1'ed already you have to waste another Boost 3 to get the actual boost in? I think its neccessary that if you have a Weak 1 on you and you boost 3 you should get a Boost 2 stats.. Since 3 minus 1 equals 2 right? I think this is neccessary cuz I HATE IT when a Friggin Mummy Weaks a Knight before you can Boost 3 and it doesnt do anything. And then you just gotta waste another 38 MP just to friggin get the job done right. So you think we should cater to your whim of a simple problem just because you hate it? Kumog could totally kick your ass with talk of Etrian Oddysey 2. If it pisses you off that much, maybe Great Mummies SHOULD have Weak 3 and go so far as to make the Knight COMPLETELY useless, rather than Weak 1 now and making them only somewhat useless. WeThe Brotherhood should also make it harder on Red Mages to play just because you complain to try and make them better rather than such actually sensible things to help them. (How many times did you suggest an 'ultimate' spell for Red Mages? 3?)
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Post by Firemaster on Jun 23, 2008 7:12:32 GMT -6
Boosts... I dont get it.. In Mona... Boost 3 can get overrunned by Weak 1? Wtf. And when your weak1'ed already you have to waste another Boost 3 to get the actual boost in? I think its neccessary that if you have a Weak 1 on you and you boost 3 you should get a Boost 2 stats.. Since 3 minus 1 equals 2 right? I think this is neccessary cuz I HATE IT when a Friggin Mummy Weaks a Knight before you can Boost 3 and it doesnt do anything. And then you just gotta waste another 38 MP just to friggin get the job done right. So you think we should cater to your whim of a simple problem just because you hate it? Kumog could totally kick your ass with talk of Etrian Oddysey 2. If it pisses you off that much, maybe Great Mummies SHOULD have Weak 3 and go so far as to make the Knight COMPLETELY useless, rather than Weak 1 now and making them only somewhat useless. WeThe Brotherhood should also make it harder on Red Mages to play just because you complain to try and make them better rather than such actually sensible things to help them. (How many times did you suggest an 'ultimate' spell for Red Mages? 3?) 1. Its just a damned suggestion so calm the friggin' hell down. 2. I only asked for a new RedMage spell once. 3. Weak 3 for Mummies will completely be ownge. I think its just better to reduce the effects of Boost 3 into a Boost 1. 4. I didnt say I hated MUMMIES WEAK.. I said I HATED when I had to waste ANOTHER BOOST 3 to get the real Boost 3 in. Re-read. And everybody else hates it too. Especially Wisseh, cuz he loves murdering stuff at Mona withh Boost 3.
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Post by lordphoenix on Jun 23, 2008 9:21:38 GMT -6
1. Its just a damned suggestion so calm the friggin' hell down. 2. I only asked for a new RedMage spell once. 3. Weak 3 for Mummies will completely be ownge. I think its just better to reduce the effects of Boost 3 into a Boost 1. 4. I didnt say I hated MUMMIES WEAK.. I said I HATED when I had to waste ANOTHER BOOST 3 to get the real Boost 3 in. Re-read. And everybody else hates it too. Especially Wisseh, cuz he loves murdering stuff at Mona withh Boost 3. I believe he's pretty calm, and I just had to interject and say that you did indeed petition for an ultimate red mage spell on at least 3 seperate occasions. Debuffs are supposed to be a pain in the ass and not a minor inconvenience. The only real "fix" I see the need for, since we're already on the subject, is a change up in the tier 2 versions of buffs. What's the problem with current tier 2s? They cost a shit ton of mp and are very minor in effect. I don't know about others, but I've only rarely seen tier 2 buff spells get put to use, and then, it's usually more in the interest of novelty. What's my improvement suggestion? Make them function as tier 2 debuffs already do, meaning they give the entire party the same effect of the tier 1 version. If such a change were implemented, you could even raise the mp cost if you felt the need in the interest of balance, but really, they just aren't cost effective as they stand now.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 23, 2008 10:03:04 GMT -6
1. Its just a damned suggestion so calm the friggin' hell down. 2. I only asked for a new RedMage spell once. 3. Weak 3 for Mummies will completely be ownge. I think its just better to reduce the effects of Boost 3 into a Boost 1. 4. I didnt say I hated MUMMIES WEAK.. I said I HATED when I had to waste ANOTHER BOOST 3 to get the real Boost 3 in. Re-read. And everybody else hates it too. Especially Wisseh, cuz he loves murdering stuff at Mona withh Boost 3. I believe he's pretty calm, and I just had to interject and say that you did indeed petition for an ultimate red mage spell on at least 3 seperate occasions. Debuffs are supposed to be a pain in the ass and not a minor inconvenience. The only real "fix" I see the need for, since we're already on the subject, is a change up in the tier 2 versions of buffs. What's the problem with current tier 2s? They cost a shit ton of mp and are very minor in effect. I don't know about others, but I've only rarely seen tier 2 buff spells get put to use, and then, it's usually more in the interest of novelty. What's my improvement suggestion? Make them function as tier 2 debuffs already do, meaning they give the entire party the same effect of the tier 1 version. If such a change were implemented, you could even raise the mp cost if you felt the need in the interest of balance, but really, they just aren't cost effective as they stand now. What is it with people and thinking that anything contradictory can not be calm at all? So, correct me if I'm wrong, but I've always thought that one of the main opposites of 'calm' would be panicky. It certainly seems to merit the need to be told to calm down. Other than that, it would have to be hyperness or some other eccentric mood such as that. On that subject, with panicky and whatnot, my closest friends have NEVER seen me panic. Never. For the most part, anything that would make me panic, I get hysteria instead and go psychotic. But panic? Never. And I don't exactly think I'm hyper. I may be squirrelly, as says Nate, but hyper? It is impossibly rare for me to get so angry I'll start foaming at the mouth and visibly want to destroy someone. In fact, for that matter, I could work up a list of things I've been called relating in some form to 'calm'. -Indifferent -Apathetic -Lethargic -Agnostic (I know what it means. It can still be connected to this subject.) People have COMPLAINED that they haven't seen me really angry. So. Explain to me, Firemaster, what it is about me that makes me seem twitchy, panicky, angry, overreactive, squirrelly, moody, anxious, nervous, hysterical, unnerved, agitated, dismayed, distraught, fraught, fretful, tense, overwrought, uneasy, chagrined. Why do you think that because I'm telling you, "No. That is a stupid idea." that I am disconcert? And it wasn't 'just a damned suggestion'. It was a complaint. Oh, and by the way, LP. Firemaster is the only Red Mage I know that uses Fast 2 in TotE.ever. Excuse me while I find proof that you DID ask for an ultimate Red Mage spell at least three times. Also, I'm banning you from the term 'ownage' for overly incorrect usage. ;DThats not much of a bad idea Jummz... So technically what your saying is if you gain a tier 3 spell make it less of a trouble to use the tier 1 spell. But also make like when you first learn your new spell make as though it takes more time.. Then instead of waiting for your next tier spell to go help you go faster with your first 1 make it as though every level you seem to go a little bit faster.. Almost like your gaining experience from using it alot.. Then the more experience you gain using it helps you do it faster... Also,,;,, About RedMages and WhiteMages... I don't see why WhiteMages, mages meant mostly to heal rather than do damage, have the strong spell White; while RedMages, mages meant to do damage with magic and physical abilities don't have a spell like that.. Now I'm not suggesting to take out white from WhiteMages but I'm just wondering why Healing mages have a sper oemaga spell when fighting mages don't I'm not sure if this was a suggestion already or not for I have not been on the forums for a while do to Xbox Live, my laziness, and....Xbox Live ;D..... But I will state nevertheless... -RedMage- Instill Elements 2 - 40 mp - After a physical attack, a magical spell will follow after that physical. Same thing as an instill elements 1. The only change to Instill Elelments 2 is that lets say if you choose Fire as your Instill Element, instead of Fire 1 following you get Fire 2. Same thing for Ice and Lit. If the Physical attack misses, that will not effect whether or not the Instill Element will. Instill Elements 3 - 60 mp - The same exact thing as instill elements 2 and 1. After a physical attack a magical spell follows. The only difference is that its the 3rd tier of the spell. Such as Fire 3, Ice 3, and Lit 3. There's one thing I'd like to add to Instill Elements 3. If the player chooses to do this. They can change it from Single spell to Area spell. But to change it from Single to Area makes it an extra 15 mp. So instead of 60 mp it will be 75 mp. Also, I love how in that last one you implied we were dumbasses and couldn't add 60 and 15. -RedMage- I think its only fair that RedMages get some kind of super spell. Blackmages have Nuke, Whitemages have White, BlueMages have Pearl. I just think that its not fair that we Redmges don't get a superspell. In ToTE its almost impossible to win without a party. Our stongest spell is the Level 3 spell of what we chose. And if you chose Fire and get to ToTE with fire your screwed unless you go back to Monastery or the New Area that I heard of is vulnerable to fire. If we do get that kind of Spell I'd call it red magic or something like that. And plz make it strong lol. I'm tired of having RedMages super weak. It'd be cool to have it look like all three fire spells. In the middle would be Fire 3. The big Circle of Fire =]. The surrounding that would be Fire 2. Big range of Fire. Then going through the middle would be Fire 1. The puny piece of crap. So in all would be: A huge circle of fire in the middle. Surrounding it like a squaare would be fire 2. Then going through th middle of everything would be fire 1. Do note: You whine a lot.
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Post by Firemaster on Jun 23, 2008 12:24:30 GMT -6
I believe he's pretty calm, and I just had to interject and say that you did indeed petition for an ultimate red mage spell on at least 3 seperate occasions. Debuffs are supposed to be a pain in the ass and not a minor inconvenience. The only real "fix" I see the need for, since we're already on the subject, is a change up in the tier 2 versions of buffs. What's the problem with current tier 2s? They cost a shit ton of mp and are very minor in effect. I don't know about others, but I've only rarely seen tier 2 buff spells get put to use, and then, it's usually more in the interest of novelty. What's my improvement suggestion? Make them function as tier 2 debuffs already do, meaning they give the entire party the same effect of the tier 1 version. If such a change were implemented, you could even raise the mp cost if you felt the need in the interest of balance, but really, they just aren't cost effective as they stand now. What is it with people and thinking that anything contradictory can not be calm at all? So, correct me if I'm wrong, but I've always thought that one of the main opposites of 'calm' would be panicky. It certainly seems to merit the need to be told to calm down. Other than that, it would have to be hyperness or some other eccentric mood such as that. On that subject, with panicky and whatnot, my closest friends have NEVER seen me panic. Never. For the most part, anything that would make me panic, I get hysteria instead and go psychotic. But panic? Never. And I don't exactly think I'm hyper. I may be squirrelly, as says Nate, but hyper? It is impossibly rare for me to get so angry I'll start foaming at the mouth and visibly want to destroy someone. In fact, for that matter, I could work up a list of things I've been called relating in some form to 'calm'. -Indifferent -Apathetic -Lethargic -Agnostic (I know what it means. It can still be connected to this subject.) People have COMPLAINED that they haven't seen me really angry. So. Explain to me, Firemaster, what it is about me that makes me seem twitchy, panicky, angry, overreactive, squirrelly, moody, anxious, nervous, hysterical, unnerved, agitated, dismayed, distraught, fraught, fretful, tense, overwrought, uneasy, chagrined. Why do you think that because I'm telling you, "No. That is a stupid idea." that I am disconcert? And it wasn't 'just a damned suggestion'. It was a complaint. Oh, and by the way, LP. Firemaster is the only Red Mage I know that uses Fast 2 in TotE.ever. Excuse me while I find proof that you DID ask for an ultimate Red Mage spell at least three times. Also, I'm banning you from the term 'ownage' for overly incorrect usage. Also, I love how in that last one you implied we were dumbasses and couldn't add 60 and 15. -RedMage- I think its only fair that RedMages get some kind of super spell. Blackmages have Nuke, Whitemages have White, BlueMages have Pearl. I just think that its not fair that we Redmges don't get a superspell. In ToTE its almost impossible to win without a party. Our stongest spell is the Level 3 spell of what we chose. And if you chose Fire and get to ToTE with fire your screwed unless you go back to Monastery or the New Area that I heard of is vulnerable to fire. If we do get that kind of Spell I'd call it red magic or something like that. And plz make it strong lol. I'm tired of having RedMages super weak. It'd be cool to have it look like all three fire spells. In the middle would be Fire 3. The big Circle of Fire =]. The surrounding that would be Fire 2. Big range of Fire. Then going through the middle would be Fire 1. The puny piece of crap. So in all would be: A huge circle of fire in the middle. Surrounding it like a squaare would be fire 2. Then going through th middle of everything would be fire 1. Do note: You whine a lot. 1. 'Calm Down' as in how I say is just an expression. I say it all the time. 2. Yes I do use Fast 2 alot so that my party can do damage to the enemies before they can get us. 3. Only 1 of them is a 'super om ownge spell'. The others were suggestions and complaints. An instill elements 2 and 3 are not considered super spells. And the First one I was just complaining.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 30, 2008 10:24:56 GMT -6
On the topic of the much beloved Ice Caverns. ----- <Sur Realis>: I'm gonna suggest a classic AI system for the Brotherhood. <Sur Realis>: Because right now, everything is random. <Koro the Reaper>: hmm <Koro the Reaper>: what do you mean an AI system? <Sur Realis>: In the original Final Fantasy, it was 'random' but it was actually a sort of order to it. <Sur Realis>: I'll explain after this battle. <Koro the Reaper>: k <Koro the Reaper>: I feel like Hika did when you asked her that math question <Koro the Reaper>: Sur Realis has set up camp. <Sur Realis>: The original Final Fantasy on the NES had a 'Random Number Generator' (RNG) that wasn't actually random at all. Instead, it was a series of lists based on how many times the player had stepped on tiles that can spike 'random battles'. <Sur Realis>: Say you had walked twenty steps. If you were to hit a battle on the twenty-first step, it would ALWAYS be the same battle if you got in that battle in that area. <Koro the Reaper>: hmm <Sur Realis>: You would always get the same battle on the same step as per that area. However, if you were to hit the battle on the twenty-first step while moving to a different set of monsters, it would always be the same battle, just a different set. <Koro the Reaper>: that second part confused me XD <Sur Realis>: It is also the same for pre-emptive strikes and ambushes - it is all predetermined, but it 'feels' random until you dissect the game. <Koro the Reaper>: I'll just pretend I understand <Sur Realis>: Now, because of this, monsters don't actually randomly cast spells. They do it in a specific order, always. <Koro the Reaper>: mmkay <Sur Realis>: For example - Chaos, the final boss, ALWAYS CUR4s on the EIGHTH turn. <Sur Realis>: Never the seventh, never the ninth. <Koro the Reaper>: mmkay <Sur Realis>: Astos always starts off with RUB. Period. Always starts with RUB. <Sur Realis>: Then he'll go through a list of spells; normal attack, DARK, FIR2, SLO2, and so on for a while, coming back to RUB. <Sur Realis>: Then it will repeat. <Koro the Reaper>: Realis always ends with Realis. Period. <Sur Realis>: Hehe. <Koro the Reaper>: XD <Koro the Reaper>: mmkay, I think I get the general idea <Sur Realis>: However, in this game, all the fights are pure random. <Koro the Reaper>: hey looky <Koro the Reaper>: it's a person Koro the Reaper waves to the person <Z Striker>: hi <Sur Realis>: Hai. <Z Striker>: may i join <Koro the Reaper>: can he make it the last two steps without getting in a battle? <Koro the Reaper>: XD <Sur Realis>: If you can live that gap, sure. o.O <Z Striker>: lol <Koro the Reaper>: damn <Koro the Reaper>: I was hoping you'd get bushed after the first step <Koro the Reaper>: that would've been funny <Sur Realis>: Anyway, I'm going to suggest to the Brotherhood that they make somewhat of a list like that, too. Like: for every time the Frost Wyrm casts Ice2, they have to attack once also. <Koro the Reaper>: yeah... <Sur Realis>: This would prevent unconditional magic spam, while still retaining the threat. <Koro the Reaper>: yeah <Koro the Reaper>: I'm not sure if it's quite as important, but they could stand to fix the Val/Guard Drain spam, in my opinion <Koro the Reaper>: lol... <Sur Realis>: That would be a good place to test it, too - on Vallatio. Make it so every 4th turn he casts a tier-2. <Koro the Reaper>: yeah ----- As it stands now, like I said, you can have pure bloody luck with magical enemies, or get brutally and graphically assraped by them. Now, I like a challenge, and I love difficulty - I don't like impossible situations. When a Level 46 Black Mage, a level almost ready for a boss an entire two areas ahead has trouble on the journey through the Ice Caverns, something is a bit unbalanced. And it isn't just the Ghosts. Earlier this morning, Koro and I were trying to get to Mona. A Level 36 Thief and Level 41 Red Mage. We knew what we were doing, what to attack first, what to do yada yada yada. We died from an ambush less than 20 steps in IC1.It was a lovely 10 enemy ambush, placing us in a five-against-one situation. Each Ice 2 dealt roughly 60 to each of us. All 10 enemies indeed cast Ice 2. Sur was hidden for an entire half of a turn, and Koro never even got to use Instill Fire on a Wyrm. First of all, I think it is ridiculous that two people can be ambushed by 10 enemies. Furthermore, with five of them large enemies (out of a global maximum of eight), there was pretty much no hope that we'd win the battle with Ice 2 being blasted out more than every other attack. Also, for the most part every amount of parties will have at MOST a 4:1 ambush. Solo has four. Eight have 32. Why should two people, who are amazingly limited in versatility, get slated? Even more is that supposedly the larger the group, the worse the Chaotics. All those 500 groups of people going out in the Hunting Grounds didn't have slack for shit. Shouldn't it progressively be less enemies for a smaller party? Second - it's just too much magic either way. As it is, only four classes can heal others, two of them lacking in this department. Two other classes can heal themselves, but one is limited in MP TO heal themselves and the other is limited in enemies to heal from. Therefore, an average of one every five people in the party will be able to heal well enough to keep up with the magic spam. And most of the time they can't. With Gore, EAT, Paralyze, Sleep, Poison, Ice 2, Lit 2, enemies that are impossible to outspeed, enemies that cast Cure, Disease, Demi, Fire 2, Drain, and just about every enemy having incredible physical power to boot, don't you think that Ice Caverns are a bit TOO threatening? This is why I'm proposing an AI List similar to in Final Fantasy for the NES. Perhaps not so strict, but not everything relying entirely on random numbers - after all, the first boss casting three tier-2 spells in a row is overpowered in itself (especially considering that these tier-2 spells end out doing MORE than tier-2 spells far later in the game).
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Post by Kyou on Jun 30, 2008 10:32:58 GMT -6
Or better yet, just let me edit all the monsters stats and moves in IC.
I promise I'll be nice.
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Post by Sur Realis on Jun 30, 2008 10:35:12 GMT -6
Or better yet, just let me edit all the monsters stats and moves in IC. I promise I'll be nice. D= No you won't. You'd make them all target Thieves named 'Sur Realis'.
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Post by Kyou on Jun 30, 2008 12:00:44 GMT -6
Only with magic
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Post by Kija on Jun 30, 2008 14:15:19 GMT -6
I already have a new type of system planned for attacks, which I prefer more than the one suggested.
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Post by Kyou on Jul 8, 2008 18:56:00 GMT -6
I already have a new type of system planned for attacks, which I prefer more than the one suggested.[/quote Can we be privy to this knowledge, or will we have to wait and see?
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Post by Kija on Jul 8, 2008 19:06:48 GMT -6
It is a wait and see sort of thing.
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Post by Sur Realis on Sept 19, 2008 13:42:35 GMT -6
I suggested this before, somewhere, concerning Meditate and how it is tedious when an actual turn is devoted to just the animation - especially when Mages use Meditate all. The. Time.
Before, I had suggested something along the lines that instead of Meditating have an entire turn animation devoted to it, it should work like Retort or Jump and activate as soon as it is selected, recovering MP then.
As an addendum...
I think Meditate should activate as soon as it is selected rather than whenever that player's turn comes around. However, instead of 'immediately' recovering MP, like I had previously suggested, perhaps it should work slightly differently. At the end of the turn, after Dragoon's Jumps end, the battle animation for Meditating will end and it will show in battle text how much MP was recovered. Also... while the Mage is Meditating, every enemy that hits them is a little less MP recovered - 1 or 2 MP at most. Should the Mage die while Meditating, it will recover a partial amount of their MP. However, the more enemies that go in a battle turn, the more MP is recovered.
So, for example, there is a party of 3 Dragoons and a White Mage. They are fighting 12 Imps. (Pfft.)
Dragoon 1 - Jump Dragoon 2 - Jump Dragoon 3 - Jump White Mage - Meditate Imp 1 - Lured Imp 2 - Lured Imp 3 - Lured Imp 4 - Lured Imp 5 -- White Mage >>> 1 DMG Imp 6 - Lured Imp 7 - Lured Imp 8 - Lured Imp 9 - Lured Imp 10 -- White Mage >>> MISS Imp 11 - Lured Imp 12 - Lured Dragoon 1 - Imp 1 >>> 1000 DMG Dragoon 2 - Imp 2 >>> 1000 DMG Dragoon 3 - Imp 3 >>> 1000 DMG White Mage - Meditate >> 42 MP recovered.
Now then, there were 15 actual turns - 10 Imps lured, 2 Imps attacked, 3 Dragoons attacked. For each of these turns, the White Mage recovered 3 MP; just an example - this would probably have to be heavily modified according to the ability to Meditate 120 MP in a turn, but still. Two Imps attacked the White Mage, one landed (-2 MP) and one missed (-1 MP). 42 MP recovered.
Thoughts? Comments? Flames? Lay 'em on meh.
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Post by Kija on Sept 19, 2008 23:27:51 GMT -6
I like that idea. Meditate would definitely look cooler if it was more like defend, where you do it, and you move back into a meditate position, and then just gain MP at the end of the round. I think meditate and MP in general still needs a little reworking though.
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